Engine management light

[Adams1104]

Hi all,

I hope someone may be able to help.

I'm an owner of a '02 Japanese import MK3, 44k miles with the only alterations being the speedo KMH -> MPH conversation and a fog light toggle switch installed.

Since purchasing, the engine management light has always been on and there is no issues when running the car. The person who I bought it from (a very close friend) said they have had the same light present since they bought it and it had never been an issue and is likely an oxygen sensor or something similar. Last years MOT passed, 0 issues. However, I put it in today and it failed on an immediate fail of "Engine mil inoperative or a malfunction [8.2.1.2 (h)]" - Apparently, a new MOT check the government has brought in to ensure emissions levels are managed.

The chap at the MOT place (kwik-fit, who passed me last year), said that if I can clear that light within 10 days, I can take it back and they will pass me, free of charge. I've taken it to 3 mechanics today, who have all put their diagnostics on the car and none of them can connect to it properly (we're presuming due to it being Japanese?? but that's speculation). The power is present, as it turned on the kits which require the ignition to be present. The one which had inbuilt power also didn't connect.

I've got it booked in with a company on Edgeware Road called Jem for next week, who I am guessing can sort this out, but am guessing also at a hefty price.

I am really looking to see anyone knows a process that I can do manually just to knock out the engine management light. I've opened face panel of the dials and there are no independent lamps to unscrew but instead it's an inbuilt LED to the PCB, which I am reluctant to disable in case it destroys the whole board.

Any help with this issue will be greatly appreciated.

Cheers,

George

[M07775]

I had mine serviced in March, told there would be no problem with the engine light on but failed 3 months later in the same garage because of engine warning light remained on.

My problem was the lambda sensors, both of them. Car actually runs a lot smoother now although it was running fine before.

Garage charged me £100 plus VAT for diagnoses as they got an auto electrician out to check it over.

Wish I was an auto electrician!

There is an issue with getting the sensors for the MRS available from only one manufacturer, garaged charged me £45 + VAT each but were available on ebay for £30, or for Toyota at £325 for a pair but that includes VAT.

Edit: Clean the oxygen sensor and see if thast cures it.

I was told to put some black tape over the LED, but I refer have the issue sorted.

[jimi]

It won't pass with tbe management light taped over

Engine malfunction indicator lamp

Turn on the ignition and check that the engine malfunction indicator lamp (MIL) illuminates and then goes off. On some vehicles it will be necessary to start the engine before the MIL goes off.
Defect
Engine MIL inoperative or indicating a malfunction
Category
Major

[Adams1104]

I had mine serviced in March, told there would be no problem with the engine light on but failed 3 months later in the same garage because of engine warning light remained on.

My problem was the lambda sensors, both of them. Car actually runs a lot smoother now although it was running fine before.

Garage charged me £100 plus VAT for diagnoses as they got an auto electrician out to check it over.

Wish I was an auto electrician!

There is an issue with getting the sensors for the MRS available from only one manufacturer, garaged charged me £45 + VAT each but were available on ebay for £30, or for Toyota at £325 for a pair but that includes VAT.

Edit: Clean the oxygen sensor and see if thast cures it.

I was told to put some black tape over the LED, but I refer have the issue sorted.

Thanks for the reply. I will keep these prices in mind when taking it in for works.

I'm not technical (in the slightest), would the oxygen sensors be somewhere I can get at and clean easily?

Cheers,

George

[Adams1104]

It won't pass with tbe management light taped over

Engine malfunction indicator lamp

Turn on the ignition and check that the engine malfunction indicator lamp (MIL) illuminates and then goes off. On some vehicles it will be necessary to start the engine before the MIL goes off.
Defect
Engine MIL inoperative or indicating a malfunction
Category
Major

Okay, so what you're saying is that if the MOT place doesn't see that MIL light on start up it will fail immediately?

Cheers

[MRHAPPY62]

correct

[jimi]

correct

Tester will check that the CEL (MIL) comes on when the ignition is turned on and goes out either a few seconds later or when the engine is started.
If it doesn't or comes on wbile tbe engine is running its classed as a major defect which is a Fail.

[jimi]

If your car is definitely an import (MR-S) then you can check the fault codes using a paperclip

All the codes on your MR-S can be read from the dash of the car with nowt more than a paper clip!

Follow the guidance at http://codes.rennacs.com/plugins/Toyota ... Avalon.php by bridging the pins with half a paper clip or something of the sort. (Ignore the fact it's for a Toyota Avalon - codes are the same).

Read the flashes of the CEL for engine codes as described in the link,
(You'll probably need to put your finger over the ABS light, as it's quite distracting trying to count CEL flashes with the ABS light flickering away next to it!)

Look up the definition of the code using the link provided - Ignore the fact the link is for different toyota models - the list matches up for many many cars, as it's a standard code list. After getting the code definition using the link, you can verify the diagnosis using http://www.jobd2.com/, and find solutions via google searches (e.g. "Toyota Fault Code 28" etc...,).

[M07775]

I had mine serviced in March, told there would be no problem with the engine light on but failed 3 months later in the same garage because of engine warning light remained on.

My problem was the lambda sensors, both of them. Car actually runs a lot smoother now although it was running fine before.

Garage charged me £100 plus VAT for diagnoses as they got an auto electrician out to check it over.

Wish I was an auto electrician!

There is an issue with getting the sensors for the MRS available from only one manufacturer, garaged charged me £45 + VAT each but were available on ebay for £30, or for Toyota at £325 for a pair but that includes VAT.

Edit: Clean the oxygen sensor and see if thast cures it.

I was told to put some black tape over the LED, but I refer have the issue sorted.

But the engine man light is not a legal requirement, so if it is not fitted it can't be checked????

I don't know though, it is what I been told and I have had cars that do not have a engine man warning light

[Adams1104]

If your car is definitely an import (MR-S) then you can check the fault codes using a paperclip

All the codes on your MR-S can be read from the dash of the car with nowt more than a paper clip!

Follow the guidance at http://codes.rennacs.com/plugins/Toyota ... Avalon.php by bridging the pins with half a paper clip or something of the sort. (Ignore the fact it's for a Toyota Avalon - codes are the same).

Read the flashes of the CEL for engine codes as described in the link,
(You'll probably need to put your finger over the ABS light, as it's quite distracting trying to count CEL flashes with the ABS light flickering away next to it!)

Look up the definition of the code using the link provided - Ignore the fact the link is for different toyota models - the list matches up for many many cars, as it's a standard code list. After getting the code definition using the link, you can verify the diagnosis using http://www.jobd2.com/, and find solutions via google searches (e.g. "Toyota Fault Code 28" etc...,).

This is great information, thank you! I can get my head it but am not entirely sure of how to do it. Will try and find a video guide on it or something.

[Adams1104]

UPDATE from my visit to Joe Bloggs garage today:- They connected their diagnostics kit (third one that's been tried) to the car and they found that their kit could see all things except the ECU. So, they could see that the air bags, seat belt sensor, etc were being read as "Pass", but when it went to connect to the engine, it was just timing out...

Am due at the Toyota import garage (Jem) tomorrow, so hopefully they will know how to get this resolved quite easily. Expensively, though, most likely.

If anyone has any experience with paying to get an ECU worked on/reconnected, it would be nice to know before hand just how far my pants are going to be pulled down over the price.

[jimi]

But the engine man light is not a legal requirement, so if it is not fitted it can't be checked????

The quote in my post is from the new MOT test. Being a legal requirement is not relevant to the MOT, being not fitted and taped over are 2 different things, the MR-S came with one fitted, there is no option not to have one fitted so it has to work.

[TonyleFrog]

But the engine man light is not a legal requirement, so if it is not fitted it can't be checked????

I rather think that is stating the obvious!
The question of whether a MIL ought to be there* is something else.
Hence removing the lamp/taping over it won't wash.

* i.e. the vehicle was fitted with one from new by the manufacturer.

See Section 8.2.1 Defect item h. - https://www.mot-testing.service.gov.uk/ ... ection_8.2

I don't know though, it is what I been told and I have had cars that do not have a engine man warning light

I've driven plenty of cars which were never equipped with one by the manufacturer.
In the days before mass market cars had computerised engine controls (ECUs).

Am due at the Toyota import garage (Jem) tomorrow, so hopefully they will know how to get this resolved quite easily. Expensively, though, most likely.

gavsdavs on here has used Jem. PM him.

[Adams1104]

UPDATE:

So, I've got the MOT pass. We did a bit of a work around by getting the light manually turned off before the test and that made it pass, as they were only able to turn it off temporarily. Each time the engine is turned off and back on, the light re-appears. Had to pay for the diagnostics/light removal and an MOT at the same place. £54 for the diagnostics and £40 for the MOT, which is more than I wanted but atleast it made it through.

A positive is that I found out what that engine light was on for. It was an oxygen sensor, which ultimately in the long run will need to be replaced but for a year atleast I can use the car legally.

Thanks for everyone who assisted in responding to my post. Appreciated.

Cheers,

George